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Post by qtpie101 on Mar 15, 2002 22:36:17 GMT -5
hey everyone i've got an essay to write and it has to do with why students should not be punished for choosing not to say the pledge of allegiance (sp?). if ne1 has any good websites to go to w/ laws to back up our right not to, or just knows about the laws please tell me! thanx
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Post by pettyluv on Mar 15, 2002 22:50:46 GMT -5
Well, I do not believe that there is a law requiring one to recite the Pledge of Allegiance, but out of respect I would hope that one would at least stand for the Pledge. I think it would be a very asinine notion not to stand for the Pledge and respect the flag and those that have died for it so that you may be free. Sure you may have that right not respect our Founding Fathers, not to respect the blood that payed for it, but if you do not have enough intergrity to stand for the Pledge, then I have absolutely no respect for you. You are very lucky to live in such a country, I am sure there are millions throughout the world that would give their limb to come to America and give her the respect that is due. Like I said, you have every Constitutional right to not stand for the Pledge, but I feel that one has a patriotic obligation to.
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Post by NaruNarusegawa on Mar 15, 2002 23:04:36 GMT -5
I totally agree with pettyluv 100%. Well said!
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Post by Soleluna on Mar 16, 2002 1:04:01 GMT -5
Well but for example I am an Italian citizen and in my school ( when I was in the US) I was forced to say the PLedge. I am patriotic too, but for my country... so I think in that case they should let one choose.
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Post by NaruNarusegawa on Mar 16, 2002 3:15:30 GMT -5
"Well but for example I am an Italian citizen and in my school ( when I was in the US) I was forced to say the PLedge. I am patriotic too, but for my country... so I think in that case they should let one choose."
Did you live in the US at the time? Since you went to school here I'm gonna assume here that you did, and if so. Why wouldn't you want to respect the country that you're currently living in? Why do you want to put a slap on a face to the men and women who died so *you* could be free while living here?
I don't think anybody here is against being patrotic to where your blood line is or anything, but you *should* at least respect this country if you're gonna be here, and if not. Like pettyluv said, I have absolutely no respect for ingrates.
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Post by -*- Little Miss Strawberry -*- on Mar 16, 2002 7:05:30 GMT -5
Would anyone mind defining what this Pledge is? I've heard of it, but I'm British so what it is/says I don't know.
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Post by pettyluv on Mar 16, 2002 15:40:54 GMT -5
^^Sure
I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands: one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
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Post by Soleluna on Mar 16, 2002 19:47:54 GMT -5
'Did you live in the US at the time? Since you went to school here I'm gonna assume here that you did, and if so. Why wouldn't you want to respect the country that you're currently living in? Why do you want to put a slap on a face to the men and women who died so *you* could be free while living here?'
First because I was forced to come live in the US since my dad had to work there. Secondly, I RESPECT the Usa, but I would not pledge allegiance to a country which is not mine. If you lived in another country and they forced you to pledge your allegiance to that contry, what would you think? I was not being disrespectful of the Us. I was just loyal to MY country.
One last thing: please honey, don't take verything as a personal offence... be cool! Please please please...
Happy journey to all
Federica
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Post by pettyluv on Mar 16, 2002 19:59:22 GMT -5
^^Surely you could not be forced to recite the pledge, but standing out respect should be of no great offense to you.
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Post by NaruNarusegawa on Mar 16, 2002 22:03:09 GMT -5
"First because I was forced to come live in the US since my dad had to work there. Secondly, I RESPECT the Usa, but I would not pledge allegiance to a country which is not mine. If you lived in another country and they forced you to pledge your allegiance to that contry, what would you think? I was not being disrespectful of the Us. I was just loyal to MY country."
No you were being disrespectful. Saying the pledge to the country you live in has nothing to do with disrespecting your own country, it's just respecting the country you live in.
You can respect both countries.
However, if you choose to not respect this country. Then I have no respect for you and I'd gladly send ingrates like you back to where you came from.
Also to answer your question, if I was in your position.. .I would respect the other countries. If I was in Germany or Britian, and they had a pledge for me to say. I would gladly do it to respect that country, but that doesn't mean I still wouldn't love the US. However, respect to me is very important for both countries.
I do believe you shouldn't be forced to say it, you shouldn't have to be forced. You should want to say it. However in the US I don't think there's any law here saying you have to say it because the US is free.. .something you're taking for granted dearly. So I do think what your teacher is doing is wrong.
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Post by Soleluna on Mar 17, 2002 6:03:03 GMT -5
I am no longer living in the Us, so the prob doesn't exist anymore.
BUt hey, you have to show me RESPECT!!!! IT's one of the most important things here on spaz. I was offended by what you said. I have my point of view, you have yours, but stop calling me 'ingrate'.
By the way, I stood proudly when the pledge was recited, and would have stood anyway out of respect for the USA, I just didn't feel like reciting it. I was 10 years old, ya know.
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Post by NaruNarusegawa on Mar 17, 2002 15:43:00 GMT -5
If you're not going to respect my country, then I'm not going to respect you. I respect it, I respect all the people who died for me, and my family, and all the people living here. If you don't want to, that's your business.
However, I'd hardly consider using the word "ingrate" an insult when it just stems from being ingrateful, and not respecting a country like the US while living here is being very ingrateful to me. Especially knowing that people would sacrifice anything and everything to come here, and be free.. something you, and a lot of people seem to take for granted.
That's like going to a friend of yours house and insulting the friend's Mother for no reason who just served you dinner just because it's not your Mother. Or some shit like that. It makes no sense to me, and just because you were 10 years old is NOT an excuse in my eyes. I remember when I was 10 years old, and I knew what it meant to have respect for something like the country you live in.
Although I am glad to hear you no longer live in the US, we don't need people like you here.
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Post by LisaRocksYourWorld, yo on Mar 17, 2002 15:55:29 GMT -5
It may not be your homeland, but it's someone else's. Many people fought for a country, whether they're your nationality or not. People died to make a country what it is, families were torn apart by war. It's the same in many nations, which is why I'm saying "a country", and not "America". The least you can do, out of respect for a country, for a person standing next to you who can practice religion freely and live up to their fullest dreams, or for the men and women who died for freedom, is say a 15 second speech. <br> <<If you lived in another country and they forced you to pledge your allegiance to that contry, what would you think?>> <br> Well, I would pledge to that country. It may not be my home, but there are people that love it and have died for it.
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Post by 80s Child on Mar 17, 2002 17:02:56 GMT -5
Naru, I may not be the mod here, but watch the personal attacks against soleluna. That comment about not needing people like her here was very rude.
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Post by NaruNarusegawa on Mar 17, 2002 18:26:50 GMT -5
My appologies, but I think what she's doing is very rude as well.
I don't understand how people can sleep at night in a country they don't respect and slap the people who faught for them to be free right on the face in their graves. It's disturbing.
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